Poland insists on the return of the paintings from the Pushkin Museum of Fine - Форум по искусству и инвестициям в искусство

Мимопроходил · 07-10-2009, 12:49

The Polish Ministry of Foreign Affairs is going to appeal to Russia's authorities to request the return of nine paintings, shortly after the end of World War II, Soviet forces removed from Gdansk and is now held in Moscow at Pushkin Museum of Fine. Kommersant reported that Warsaw had previously attempted to start negotiations on the status of these paintings, but the Foreign Ministry to address this issue will be held for the first time. According to the newspaper, is currently preparing a diplomatic note.
According to information cited by Kommersant, 17 boxes of pictures were taken from Gdansk in the Pushkin Museum on Sept. 24, 1945, and a further 80 boxes were sent to the Pushkin Museum March 23, 1946 th. The Polish side suggests that, at least 25 paintings are still in the collection of the Pushkin Museum. The publication lists such works as "Poultry-yard" by Daniel Schultz, "The frightened horse," Franz Pfyule, Vindenfeldsky diptych "unknown Dutch artist," The Flight into Egypt "Cornelis van Pulenburga," Judgment Anton Muller, "Forest Landscape" by Jan Brueghel Elder. In addition, in Warsaw would like to get back to the Madonna with Child by Lucas Cranach the Elder (of the church in Glogova) and "Landscape with cows, Adrian van de Velde (from the Museum of Lodz).

Observers of Russia, the newspaper says the status of the paintings will depend on the legal status of Gdansk at the time of export of the paintings. On the one hand, Gdansk, Poland was occupied by the Germans and then the export of cultural property from its territory is considered to be compensatory restitution, that is, Russia may consider these values of their property in accordance with international law. If the date of exportation of pictures - September 24, 1945 - will be established reliably, the Polish side will insist that the boxes went to Moscow from the reconstructed Potsdamer Conference and Soviet-Polish treaty state, ie, from the independent and anti-fascist Poland.

The situation around the upcoming restorative request not comment until either the Polish embassy in Moscow, nor the Pushkin Museum of Fine. The Ministry of Culture of Russia noted that the official claim of the Polish side has not yet been received and that, indeed, such a document should be submitted through diplomatic channels.

Position of the Pushkin Museum and its director, Irina Antonova will be dictated by the fact that all the paintings in the museum collection are the property of the state, and only the State may dispose of them. The last time GMII returned cultural property to a foreign state in 2008: they were stained glass windows St. Mary's Church in Frankfurt an der Oder (Marienkirche). To send a stained-glass windows need special law.

eva777 · 07-10-2009, 16:24

I am in favor to return. All the same, do not show anything, it's all rot in the reserves. And so, at least in Poland will be to see it!

Мимопроходил · 07-10-2009, 16:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by eva777

I am for it to return. All the same, do not show anything, it's all rot in the reserves. And so, at least in Poland will be to see it!

Agree. I did not understand what "Madonna" Cranach question?? The one in GMII im. Pushkin - "Madonna and Child" - derived from the Hermitage Museum before the war, in the 30's, and before that a hundred years was in St. Petersburg. For some reason, Poland makes it right? Maybe journalists are confused about the "Madonna" Cranach?

Тютчев · 07-10-2009, 17:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by eva777

I am for it to return. All the same, do not show anything, it's all rot in the reserves. And so, at least in Poland will be to see it!

Where did you get this information. Nothing is rotting. Everything is in order, but will be even better. The Pushkin Museum is constantly expanding its exhibit spaces. I remember this happened twice. Of course, the museums, especially with such a rich collection of both Pushkin Museum of Fine does not always have enough space. But to say: "All the same, do not show anything, it's all rot in the reserves" - it is as strange, to say the least. No need to panic and the more you give, you have not purchased. As a result of such action razdavalschikov, in the 20 th century, we lost many of their masterpieces. (Masterpieces of the Hermitage, Dresden Art Gallery, etc.) to compensate for these losses is impossible.
What you propose is a crime!

The reconstruction of the Pushkin Museum. Pushkin will begin in summer 2010
28/09/200914: 38
MOSCOW, September 28 - RIA Novosti. Construction work on the reconstruction of the State Museum of Fine Arts named after AS Pushkin begin in the summer of 2010, told reporters on Monday, deputy director of the Pushkin Museum, Mikhail Gurvich.
According to him, is currently working on a project is under design and survey works, and April 1, 2010 all the necessary documents must be submitted for approval to the Main State.
Because of this, as noted by Gurvich, "construction phase will not begin until early summer of next year."
"The Government is interested in the timing and execution of this project, so we're going exactly in the schedule, which are set out in the order of the Federal Government", - he stressed.
This autumn, the museum complex will begin archaeological work is required to obtain agreement of construction in the protected zone
Reconstruction of the museum is planned in three phases to be completed by 2018. Monitoring the implementation of the program has a Board of Trustees of the museum under the chairmanship of head of MEDT Elvira Nabiullina
Competition for the reconstruction of the Pushkin Museum has won the British architect Norman Foster with "Mosproekt-5.
According to Foster's concept, isolated on Volkhonka Street and adjacent lanes of the building are combined into a single entity shared underground museum and park land areas, and in the main building of the museum would be to go straight from the underground "Kropotkin.
In addition, the Pushkin Museum, in Foster's idea, there will be several brand new buildings, most of them perceptible - exhibition hall in a cinquefoil in place of the current petrol station opposite the Cathedral of Christ the Savior, and historic buildings in the complex will be reconstructed.
For a long time, it was unclear whether you have received to build avant-garde building, because not manage to agree on the transfer of refueling elsewhere.
Now the issue seems resolved. According to Gurvitch, at a meeting of the committee, which took place this summer, had been given instructions to the government of Moscow and the Federal Security Service of Russia "at the start of work on selection of site relocation of fueling" and instructed the Finance Ministry to decide on the allocation of funds to finance the construction of a new filling.
Construction of cultural and exhibition center is derived in a promising stage of reconstruction, before we have time ", - concluded the deputy director of the museum.
In total, the Government of Russia has allocated 23 billion rubles for the period from 2009 to 2015 for activities related to the preparation and celebration of the 100-year anniversary of the museum in 2012, including the costs of large-scale transformation of the museum.
State contract price is 320 million rubles.
http://www.rian.ru/culture/20090928/186711899.html

eva777 · 07-10-2009, 17:38

Most of the "expropriated" and that it does not see, so they get the crumbs and then embarrassed some things to show. Like Schliemann gold, 50 years old was lying, and some, quite a small show.
Just so many monuments that have been removed trains after the war, from all over Europe .... impossible to take into account not to show. And what promises Antonova, so it is already 40 years of promises

Not everything in its power.

[color="# 666686"]Added after 1 minute[/color]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tjutchev

Do not panic and give away the more that you have not purchased.

not acquire this at all.

[color="# 666686"]Added after 2 minutes[/color]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tjutchev

What you propose is a crime!

what I propose, this is normal, and no offense is not.

There is no time. tomorrow обосную their point of view me more

Тютчев · 07-10-2009, 18:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by eva777

Most of the "expropriated" and that it does not see, so they get the crumbs and then embarrassed some things to show. Like Schliemann gold, 50 years old was lying, and some, quite a small show.
Just so many monuments that have been removed trains after the war, from all over Europe .... impossible to take into account not to show. And what promises Antonova, so it is already 40 years of promises

Not everything in her power.

Collections of European and American museums are replenished as a result of conquest and colonial wars. They are ashamed of, really, for good reason. And we have nothing to be ashamed, we all received as compensation for the crimes that started a "enlightened" Europe on our territory.
Museums of the Western world for centuries formed by conquest and kolonealnyh wars. Try to return the loot! So try to Egypt, Greece to recover their treasures, but can not. During the Great Patriotic War, our nation has lost an enormous number of works of art. Where are they? Somewhere in the vaults of Europe and America. (If you do not believe what has been destroyed, and ssozheno pokorezheno) And no this is not going to give! Alone, we always blame and forever robbed such as the minister or the secretary-general ##############betrayers of national interests. Thankfully, not all had stolen! And, thank God, not all like them! There are those who, on the contrary, acquire and multiply wealth and glory of the Fatherland!

nikolai nesterenko · 07-10-2009, 18:12

restitution of cultural property, is being discussed all over the world, and not only discussed, but in some cases, decide (the return of the owners or their heirs of art objects, excluded, eg. in Nazi Germany, Austria, etc.). Russia's government, and not only how much the museum, in every way opposed to restitution, in my opinion because they are afraid of the requirements to return property stolen from their own citizens during the reign of "effective manager" J. Stalin and his successors

galatey · 25-01-2011, 09:58

nikolai nesterenko, good den.a why Greece is not present in Italy the right to antique things and at the same time should not require kompensatsii.dalee medieval war looting of valuables and even Napoleon, and so it.p.

Grigory · 07-10-2009, 20:41

Please read what this forum thread!

Quote:

Art Kaleidoscope Interesting and relevant material about art. Discussion of general issues of art and all those not falling into the other thematic sections. There is only art! Love, politics, sports, other hobbies - in the "Arbor».

I repeat: There is only art!
Clear?

Тютчев · 07-10-2009, 20:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by Grigory

Please read what this forum thread!

I repeat: There is only art!Clearly?

The policy is not circumvented. I suggest this topic be moved to the "Arbor".

07-10-2009, 12:49	Original language: Russian #1
Мимопроходил Гуру Join Date: Dec 2008 Posts: 1,714 Thanks: 2,990 Thanked 2,459 Times in 639 Posts Reputation: 4794	Poland insists on the return of the paintings from the Pushkin Museum of Fine The Polish Ministry of Foreign Affairs is going to appeal to Russia's authorities to request the return of nine paintings, shortly after the end of World War II, Soviet forces removed from Gdansk and is now held in Moscow at Pushkin Museum of Fine. Kommersant reported that Warsaw had previously attempted to start negotiations on the status of these paintings, but the Foreign Ministry to address this issue will be held for the first time. According to the newspaper, is currently preparing a diplomatic note. According to information cited by Kommersant, 17 boxes of pictures were taken from Gdansk in the Pushkin Museum on Sept. 24, 1945, and a further 80 boxes were sent to the Pushkin Museum March 23, 1946 th. The Polish side suggests that, at least 25 paintings are still in the collection of the Pushkin Museum. The publication lists such works as "Poultry-yard" by Daniel Schultz, "The frightened horse," Franz Pfyule, Vindenfeldsky diptych "unknown Dutch artist," The Flight into Egypt "Cornelis van Pulenburga," Judgment Anton Muller, "Forest Landscape" by Jan Brueghel Elder. In addition, in Warsaw would like to get back to the Madonna with Child by Lucas Cranach the Elder (of the church in Glogova) and "Landscape with cows, Adrian van de Velde (from the Museum of Lodz). Observers of Russia, the newspaper says the status of the paintings will depend on the legal status of Gdansk at the time of export of the paintings. On the one hand, Gdansk, Poland was occupied by the Germans and then the export of cultural property from its territory is considered to be compensatory restitution, that is, Russia may consider these values of their property in accordance with international law. If the date of exportation of pictures - September 24, 1945 - will be established reliably, the Polish side will insist that the boxes went to Moscow from the reconstructed Potsdamer Conference and Soviet-Polish treaty state, ie, from the independent and anti-fascist Poland. The situation around the upcoming restorative request not comment until either the Polish embassy in Moscow, nor the Pushkin Museum of Fine. The Ministry of Culture of Russia noted that the official claim of the Polish side has not yet been received and that, indeed, such a document should be submitted through diplomatic channels. Position of the Pushkin Museum and its director, Irina Antonova will be dictated by the fact that all the paintings in the museum collection are the property of the state, and only the State may dispose of them. The last time GMII returned cultural property to a foreign state in 2008: they were stained glass windows St. Mary's Church in Frankfurt an der Oder (Marienkirche). To send a stained-glass windows need special law.

07-10-2009, 16:24	Original language: Russian #2
eva777 Авторитет Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Москва Posts: 806 Thanks: 1,778 Thanked 885 Times in 243 Posts Reputation: 1165	I am in favor to return. All the same, do not show anything, it's all rot in the reserves. And so, at least in Poland will be to see it! __________________ «Художник – это человек, который пишет то, что можно продать. А хороший художник – это человек, который продаёт то, что пишет». ПАБЛО ПИКАССО

07-10-2009, 18:12	Original language: Russian #7
nikolai nesterenko Пользователь Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: minsk/belarus Posts: 92 Thanks: 191 Thanked 102 Times in 31 Posts Reputation: 173	restitution of cultural property restitution of cultural property, is being discussed all over the world, and not only discussed, but in some cases, decide (the return of the owners or their heirs of art objects, excluded, eg. in Nazi Germany, Austria, etc.). Russia's government, and not only how much the museum, in every way opposed to restitution, in my opinion because they are afraid of the requirements to return property stolen from their own citizens during the reign of "effective manager" J. Stalin and his successors

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25-01-2011, 09:58	Original language: Russian #8
galatey Пользователь Join Date: Jan 2011 Posts: 60 Thanks: 161 Thanked 72 Times in 29 Posts Reputation: 146	nikolai nesterenko, good den.a why Greece is not present in Italy the right to antique things and at the same time should not require kompensatsii.dalee medieval war looting of valuables and even Napoleon, and so it.p.