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-   -   Is it possible to create and develop the art market without kommodifikatsii art? (https://forum.artinvestment.ru/showthread.php?t=48642)

AlexanderG 16.11.2009 04:08

Is it possible to create and develop the art market without kommodifikatsii art?
 
Davaite razmyshliat '.

Na dannom etape Rossiiskii art rynok nahoditsia v faze razvitiia.
Davaite podumaem, cto sostavliaet art rynok, chto nuzno razvivat ', kakie momenty neobhodimo uchityvat', chto nuzno delat 'dlia ego razvitiia.

'Rossiiskii' - ia upotrebil, kak samyi bol'shoi na post sovetskom prostranstve. Tema imeet otnoshenie ko vsem stranam byvshego SSSR.

Posted 1 hour 18 minutes
Prostaia shema art rynka (rassmatrivaem v dannom sluchae fine art i skul'pturu):

Proizvoditeli - hudozniki, skul'ptory.

Distrib'iutory (kommercheskie) - galerei, salony, auktsiony, dekoratory.

Marketing - musei, publichnye galerei, kritiki, art istoriki, kuratory, pressa.

Potrebiteli - publika, kompanii, muzei.

Podderzivaiuschie sistemy - fabriki i zavody (kraski, holsty, itd), uchebnye zavedeniia, pechatnaia produktsiia itd.

V dannoi sheme ia predlagaiu iskliuchit 'prodazi za rubez i porazmyslit' o razvitii sobstvennogo rynka.

Posav 16.11.2009 11:04

And who will be producing?. The artist is not the working class. It does not fit into this scheme.

AlexanderG 16.11.2009 11:25

Цитата:

Сообщение от Posav (Сообщение 707482)
And who will be producing?. The artist is not the working class. It does not fit into this scheme.

V sisteme rynochnyh otnoshenii hudoznik iavliaetsia proizvoditelem.
A pochemu, na vash vzgliad, hudoznik ne vpisyvaetsia?

Proizvoditel ', eto ne obiazatel'no rabochii klass. Naprimer intellektual'nyi tovar.

Кирилл Сызранский 16.11.2009 11:28

Цитата:

Сообщение от AlexanderG (Сообщение 707532)
V sisteme rynochnyh otnoshenii hudoznik iavliaetsia proizvoditelem.

Sure is.
He made a thing, painted a picture made it to the light of God, so to speak, and the word "work" from the same series.

artcol 16.11.2009 11:52

It is certainly possible to build such a model. Moreover, I put it into practice voproizvel, and it worked pretty well.
But I came to the conclusion that in this case is more important than sales and marketing, and therefore need to be addressed first and foremost it. There is a demand - will offer!

AlexanderG 16.11.2009 12:02

Цитата:

Сообщение от artcol (Сообщение 707582)
You can certainly build such a model.

Schitaiu, chto eto sovershenno neobhodimo, bolee togo eto privediot k uluchsheniiu vneshih otnoshenii.

Moreover, I put it into practice voproizvel, and it worked pretty well.

Chto slomalos'?

But I came to the conclusion that in this case is more important than sales and marketing, and therefore need to be addressed first and foremost it. There is a demand - and the proposal will be!

Dumaiu, chto spros nado razvivat '. Tovara dostatochno.
A sprashivat 'to, o, chiom neizvestno, nevozmozno.

Ved 'spros ne rozdaet predlozenie.

SAH 16.11.2009 12:07

Цитата:

Сообщение от AlexanderG (Сообщение 707632)
Dumaiu, chto spros nado razvivat

I agree, to create "a situation".

artcol 16.11.2009 12:08

Цитата:

Сообщение от AlexanderG (Сообщение 707632)
Dumaiu, chto spros nado razvivat '. Tovara dostatochno.
A sprashivat 'to, o, chiom neizvestno, nevozmozno.

Ved 'spros ne rozdaet predlozenie.

All doubt, except the last sentence.
And add: the art market in Russia is possible only as part of the World. Other options - viable.

AlexanderG 16.11.2009 12:12

Цитата:

Сообщение от SAH (Сообщение 707652)
I agree, to create "a situation".

Chto mozete sdelat '?

Added after 2 minutes
Цитата:

Сообщение от artcol (Сообщение 707662)
All doubt, except the last sentence.
Pochemu?

And add: the art market in Russia is possible only as part of the World. Other options - are not viable.

Sovershenno soglasen, no mozno byt 'polnopravnym chlenom, a mozno i. ...
Poetomu schitaiu, chto sobstvennyi razvitoi art rynok neobhodim.

artcol 16.11.2009 13:00

Цитата:

Сообщение от AlexanderG (Сообщение 707682)
Poetomu schitaiu, chto sobstvennyi razvitoi art rynok neobhodim.

Course necessary. For the art of Oceania and Africa would also be good to have their own internal national market :)

Кирилл Сызранский 16.11.2009 13:04

Цитата:

Сообщение от artcol (Сообщение 707802)
The art of Oceania and Africa would also be good to have their own internal national market

Overseas will not say, but in African countries (Africa booooolshaya!) Domestic market exists.

Posav 16.11.2009 13:06

Цитата:

Сообщение от AlexanderG (Сообщение 708)
V sisteme rynochnyh otnoshenii hudoznik iavliaetsia proizvoditelem.
A pochemu, na vash vzgliad, hudoznik ne vpisyvaetsia?

Proizvoditel ', eto ne obiazatel'no rabochii klass. Naprimer intellektual'nyi tovar.

In this scheme probably does not fit the artist and craftsman. You are missed in the chain "media brand" (eg, Hurst), and then executing.

Вивьен 16.11.2009 13:12

Цитата:

Сообщение от Posav (Сообщение 707832)
Quote:

Note from AlexanderG
V sisteme rynochnyh otnoshenii hudoznik iavliaetsia proizvoditelem.
A pochemu, na vash vzgliad, hudoznik ne vpisyvaetsia?

Proizvoditel ', eto ne obiazatel'no rabochii klass. Naprimer intellektual'nyi tovar.

In this scheme probably does not fit the artist and craftsman. You are missed in the chain "media brand" (eg, Hurst), and then executing.

You can call an artist not a producer, a man in a burst of inspiration, creating a product (artwork). By the way, can still be the producer of art to call.
 And the artist - this is a craftsman, as well as the appearance of his work - this is a craft, with his hands something to produce.

AlexanderG 16.11.2009 13:17

Вложений: 1
Цитата:

Сообщение от artcol (Сообщение 707802)
Of course necessary. For the art of Oceania and Africa would also be good to have their own internal national market <!--~ 1 ~-->

Ob Afrike ne skazu, no Avstraliiskii art rynok ne zavisit ot mezdunarodnyh prodaz. Etot rynok huze ili luchshe podderzivaet 250,000 hudoznikov.

Vnizu pritsepil otryvochek iz stat'i. V srednei kolonke posmotrite na tsifry, i eto bylo okolo 20 let nazad.

V Au okolo 500 kommercheskig galerei, mnozestvo auktsionnyh domov, ne schitaia museev, publichnyh galerei, art tsentrov i pr.

Poetomu vneshnii rynok dlia Au imeet znachenie, kak ploschadka dlia rosta tsen (na mirovom urovne), mirovoi izvestnosti (vanity). Segodniashnii Au art rynok ne mozet pokazat 'takoi ze uroven' tsen, kak USA ili GB, no tem ne menee on samodostatochen.

Цитата:

Сообщение от Posav (Сообщение 707832)
In this scheme probably does not fit the artist and craftsman. You are missed in the chain "media brand" (eg, Hurst), and then executing.

Imia hudoznika i est 'brend. Imena v dannoi situatsii ne vazny.

Odna i ta ze kartina vosproizvedionnaia raznymi avtorami (raznyi brend) budet stoit 'po - raznomu.

V dannoi teme, ia ne rassmatrivaiu esteticheskie tsennosti, a tol'ko rynochnye otnosheniia.

Otdel Marketinga sozdaiot brend (imia hudoznika), kogda eta komanda uspeshna - prodazi sootvetstvuiuschie.

Added after 1 minute
Цитата:

Сообщение от Vivien (Сообщение 707862)
can be called an artist not a producer, a man in a burst of inspiration, creating a product (artwork). By the way, can still be the producer of art to call.
 And the artist - this is a craftsman, as well as the appearance of his work - this is a craft, with his hands something to produce.

Ia pytaius 'uiti ot emotsii, a traktovat' eti poniatiia s pozitsii rynka.

NATA NOVA 16.11.2009 13:38

And in Russian-weak? (Ease-mother of genius)
 
http://leagilar.livejournal.com/185114.html\r\n How will it be in Russian?


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