December 11, 1699, Peter I founded St. Andrew's flag as the official flag of Russia

[artist]

And agree) With regard to the red-blue-white, about which he wrote later.

Approved state flag of Russia was a black-yellow-white, he was introduced by the decree of Alexander II in 1858:
"The location of flowers horizontal, the upper band of black, medium yellow (or gold), and the lower white (or silver). The first bands correspond to the black eagle in the state or yellow gold box and cockade of these two colors was founded by Emperor Paul I, Meanwhile, as the banners and other decorations of flowers were used so early as the time of the Empress Anna Ivanovna. The lower band corresponds to a silver or white cockade of Peter the Great and Empress Catherine II; same Emperor Alexander II, after the occupation of Paris in 1814, joined the correct badge stamped with an ancient Peter the Great, which corresponds to a white or silver horseman (St. George) in the Moscow coat of arms ".

It was systematized by Ken and approved by the decree of Alexander II, who no one ever in RI is not repealed.

By the way, the history of Vsevelikim VD - the fruit of "reflection" of the writer-general PN Krasnov and no more.

But, dear Fed)
I'm talking about the Ruthenians and "Leading Russian Rada", and about the principality of Galich, only to have to ask you: what does and Ukraine?)) By this logic, the current Spring EGYPTIAN pharaoh election should be over ...

Given you "banner Black Sea Cossacks" is the banner has given "the Cossack military formation in 1788, Self-PCI Created by the Russian government in 1787 from parts of the troops loyal to the Cossacks, which is based on the old Zaporozhian Cossacks. For the troops assigned territory between the Dniester and Southern Bug with the center in Slobozia.
In 1792, the army resettled to the Kuban Cossacks, which was founded 40 smoking with the center in Ekaterinodar.
In 1860, the army renamed the Kuban Cossack Host, which was annexed part of the Caucasian Cossack line (well, there's other banners).

Since, in heraldry, yellow gold is identical, that is the choice, Astrakhan coat of arms of the kingdom, Novgorod, Vladimir, and Chernigov principality contrary to verify allegations of "small cart and the cart" ... and the proof of the fact that the RI could be yellow-flag blakitny with equal bases. )))

P.S. A site PCI, for some reason, the following is written: Flag - Black Sea Cossack Army is the historical flag of PCI, which is a rectangular panel with horizontal stripes: the top - black, symbolizing great power, average - gold - a symbol of Orthodoxy, the lower - white symbolizes the generosity and dedication. As bandwidth equal to 30 cm, the ratio of the flag's width to its length is 1:2.

[Fed]

Сообщение от artist; 1888421"

proof of the fact that the RI could be a yellow- flag blakitny with equal bases. )))

The colors of flags , not mathematical formulas to create. Self- other, that of the RI and Ukraine could be any flag .

But I think it is logical to admit that if the arms of the capital , blue yellow , like the color of the masses and many cities of Ukraine Hetman's arms , the flag of the state and is well suited for blue yellow . By the way , the arms all Ukrainian provinces were pure blue or yellow, or the main board is surrounded by golden oak leaves joined by Andrew's tape.
Only Chelm ( founded in 1912. ) Was not , but it has been allocated as part of the Lublin Emblem , who was with leaves and ribbon.

Note that the coat of arms Baturin (1 fig ) - important for the Ukrainian city of self-consciousness (historic - cultural reserve ) - the residence of Hetman , is also yellow and blue .

[artist]

Сообщение от Fed

But I think it is logical to admit that if the arms of the capital, blue yellow, like the color of the masses and many cities of Ukraine Hetman's arms, the flag of the state and is well suited for blue yellow. .

I can not agree: in heraldry will destvovat logic downwards (by state)
As for the mass of cities ... I'm not above chance brought arms from the same armorial, as well, Russian (Vladimir, Novgorod), and that, "nevpolne" (Astrakhan), and everywhere gold (yellow) and blue, but Chernigov (

Actually, the adoption of various heraldic elements, usually predschestvuet certain "heraldic" history (Cossacks Mazepa navrode). Her and wanted to hear.
Although it might appear schetanie and a little earlier, and also from Sweden in 1657 when, at Rada in Korsun signed it and the alliance between the hetman Swedish Kingdom ... Out of this pravdv Pereyaslavl contract with "one of the Russian principalities." Well then there was the Ruin ...

On the coat of arms Baturin so many questions. History after all is a relatively new - XVII century. It is interesting to see precisely when the flag was adopted. They are, in general, two! (Second in the annex and red fleur-based!) Do you drawing from Panchenko, "she Miski mistechkovi Herbie Ukraina"). Residence of the hetman (Left Bank) began in 1669, after the separation. It's left bank, with its left-bank attitude towards Poland, and "one of the Russian principalities" ... There and "hooligan" is a Mazeppa ...
By the way. if you bring a coat of arms as an argument to be given today ICC coat Getmanschiny (Cossack with rifle on his shoulder) likely will not agree: although drawn from and on the similarity of the Polish heraldic shield Ampire XVII-XVIII (stretched skin), but not in the main geraldichen songs and more like a drawing of the late XIX or even 1992 ...

Yes, but what you do not term Telegram Little? Be respectful and historically ... And nothing of bull and from school Grushevskogo on what govovili Bandera Kravchuk, Kuchma .... In a small Greek or vice versa - would be proud), Ukraine, in my opinion, no matter how priznosi where no heed to the West or the East, that is not .... No?)
And I beg you, if possible, do not jump to such lekostyu from the outskirts of the suburbs and from century to century, so the trend does not follow. First, you leaned on the century XIX and non-Ukrainian Rusyns, then, for non-Ukrainian principality of Galich and vrug, century XVII and Buchanan ... I otkruchu neck. Have pity on me)))

[Fed]

By skipping over the centuries, nothing bad can not see to make flowers needed overall secular direction and key events is of Ukrainian history.

Compare with "A brief note on the old Russian banners," where to find the national colors of a special meeting to "jump" in centuries-even hard to read coherently.
They had the same problem - although it seems that 17 .- History of the relatively new, but almost everything that was previously on the armorial bearings, flags, and most importantly, by their color, shrouded in mystery. So you have to ride through the centuries, surviving in various media. By the way, they also begin with the Grunwald battle - so we are in-line search of flowers Special Meeting.

In Baturin - except Mazepa was a great sinner and Damian Ivan Samoilovich. After the defeat of the Left Bank of the capital, last hetman Razumovsky time again moved back the hetman's residence.
Note that after the debacle, the hetman residence was moved to the deaf, and the coat of arms is still preserved: on a blue background two gold hetman's mace.

But that does not do color discertatsiyami, enough for me, opinions royal academician of the Petersburg Academy of Sciences FE Kors' ... Cossack banners depicted an artist Repin in his picture, do not contain your color set no foreign trends, and reflect a certain continuity of colors of gold and heavenly, always inherent in all the insignia of Southern Russia (Ruthenia) before the time of the great princes of Kiev, until the dissolution of the Zaporozhian freemen, under the command of the Empress Catherine the Great. It says there is plenty of written evidence in domestic and foreign purely historical sources, as well as - in a number of items of tangible art of the ancient times .. .. "

Then the blue yellow head Ruska happy as the beginning of the restoration of Ukrainian statehood. Then, the prevalence of these colors in the bulk of coats of arms of cities and provinces, including the capital.
Then, the Central Rada, the hetman Skoropadsky Constitution and Ukrainian People's Republic, all blue-yellow.

Question - how then could be the flag of modern Ukraine?
Especially that, historically, only two options - red yellow and blue and yellow. Clearly, red-yellow failed to ever (and it does not outweigh historically).

Since the XVI century the name "Ukraine" is used in official documents.
 Little Russia was used in Byzantium for ecclesiastical administrative designation of one of the Ukrainian lands, the remaining part of Kievan Rus were designated - Great Russia.
Little Russian province, founded in 1764 in the early days of the Russian Empire - only part of the left-bank Ukraine (with its capital in Glukhov). Therefore, in the past, and even more so now - Little Russia as a common name has no relation to Ukraine nor geographically nor in respect of nationality.

[artist]

Banners Skoropadsky - something uninteresting. For a quote from Korsch - thank you), however, he speaks about Little (I think, not Byzantine)

Ukraine is mentioned much earlier time specified by you. only "is not related to the Ukraine (today) neither geographically nor in respect of nationality. ",
tk comes from obscheslovyanskogo (About) Stole (Q) ON (and, in any case, does not mean the nation, but only a "borderline" area.

- In the annals Hypatian 1187 mentions the year Pereyaslavskaya "oukraina», bordering the Polovtsian land. In 1189 find common Galician "oukrainu», in 1213 lists the border towns of the Galician "oukrainy»: Brest, Ugrovsk ...
- In the annals of Pskov 1271 refers to rural areas Pskov "Ukraine».
- In the Russian-Lithuanian treaty XV refers to the century «vkrainnye place», «Ukraіnye place», «Vkrainyi place», which are defined as Smolensk, Lyubutsk, Mtsensk (Spiritual and treaty ratification and the great princes XIV - XVI centuries. M. -A., 1950. S. 160 (1449), 329, 332 (1494) .
- The agreement of the two Princes of Ryazan 1496, the identified «in our villages Mordovian Tsna and ukraine».

Since end of the XVI Age (at first - the Poles), the word "Ukraine" have also (!) Denote of the earth middle reaches of the Dnieper - the central region of modern Ukraine.
In Polish sources, the royal, the Hetman (Crown Hetman) is universal ect «castles and places of our Borderland», «places and towns of Ukraine", «Ukraine Kiev» (Archive of the South-West of Russia (Archive YUZR.) Ch 3. T. 1. Kyiv, 1863 . p. 4 (1568), and C, 196 (1614), S.201 (1617)

In Moscow's sources also interesting: there is, for example, «Little Russian Borderland» ... The right bank is called the «Polish Borderland» (obviously, "the outskirts of the Polish lands," the Polish border area ... you forget even about Sloboda Ukraine (where it Denham), which, indeed, never coincided with the Stone.

Only at the end XIX century (and only then!) Theorists of nationalism and began to replace the term Little Russia Ukraine term as denoting a stable concrete territory and its people began to call Ukrainians. Like it or not, and these self-residents - Ruthenians (Rusyns but - not Ukrainians, in today's sense of the word, except a passport that is a sign of bureaucratic and unreliable))) and Little Russia, which is true of you mentioned the GREAT RUSSIA (from the Greek image, as I wrote) Insist!)))
I, for instance, historically - maloros> Russian))) (Gogol, when put into the mouth of Taras Bulba words of the Russian people, did so not as a court scribbler, and Gogol-Yanovsky, a descendant of the glorious malorossiyskogo kind). Coat of Arms with my family, almost like a kind of sinner (there is probably some tribute, Polish Heraldry ))) And you?)) If you want to call themselves Ukrainians, will indicate which side of the border you rooted )))

P.S. I am in no way, of course, do not impinge on the ter. integrity of the state of Ukraine and Square )))

[sur]

Сообщение от Fed; 1887991"

Officially, white, blue and red flag became the state of modern Russia by decree of the first President Boris Yeltsin. "Yeltsin has died , and the flag remains " »

 To me, it seems that the "correct" the Imperial Russian flag on my avatar , and when Yeltsin was adopted by a strange , possibly true:

Сообщение от Fed; 1887991"

Zhirinovsky: "The current white- blue-red tricolor -" is a flag of Kerensky and Vlasov . " Who would respect a flag ?

Kerensky Vlasov flag . I think that Yeltsin and his entourage just fawn over the West feared the normal state of modern Russia, as successor of the Russian Empire, the way it certainly is. Or, what is not, gentlemen scholars of heraldry ?

[Кирилл Сызранский]

I remember the scandal in which a 90-year: for the championship of chess two participants from one country, but Kasparov under the glorious Russian tricolor play, Karpov - under the flag of Soviet Gulag.
>

[Fed]

Сообщение от sur; 1892231"

" correct" the Imperial Russian flag on my avatar

This is allowed « for use in private life " flag .

And the main word here - " authorized ." But not free .

Cyril Syzran , for example, your avatar has a white ribbon , and called for the " glorious Russian tricolor ." Although 20 years of its operation in the early 20th century, especially nice not name.

But that's not it . Tricolour represents the time - sole anti-people government , the seizure of Economics and Finance foreigners losing the war and the people's hatred and corruption.
Nothing you do not like? So you are for or tricolor ribbon ? We ought to decide. Meanwhile, a split , as on the arms .
Or as a clever term cognitive dissonance.

How beautiful happened - the cognitive dissonance of the nation. >

[Кирилл Сызранский]

Сообщение от Fed

ought to be defined.

This is someone, I'm sorry?

[Fed]

Сообщение от Cyril Syzran ; 1892341"

This is someone , I'm sorry ?

The nation.

Classic Jewish sage Radzikhovsky yesterday expressed an interesting idea , " Russia - the last of the big European countries , which did not completely banal one for the XXI century thing - which is not shifted from a monarchy to a republic. All countries have moved , it would take hundreds of years. " At some point she " jumped over the horse's head " and rasshiblas , " But the transition from monarchy to republic , from psevdomonarhii from kvazimonarhii from okolomonarhii to a republic , I think, be accomplished fairly quickly."

To be determined.

Добавлено через 1 час 15 минут
From the Brockhaus and Efron: The best expert on the history of Polish time W., A. Yablonovskii, believes that half of the XVII century, "the name of" W. "... embraced a south-east. Nyn part. Podolia province, a significant part of Kiev, unless south-western part of Chernihiv, Poltava and the entire large part of the provinces of Kherson and Ekaterinoslav.

By the middle of the XVII century. administratively divided into two U. province - Kiev and Bratslav. In 1654, William joined with Moscow. By Andrusovo contract in 1667 for the left bank remained W. Moscow, the right bank - to Poland. Since then, the Left Bank U. customary name is Little Russia. On the left bank of the Dnieper Ukraine officially called the only Y. Slobodskaya, ie, present-day Kharkiv province. on the right side of the Dnieper name William survived over all the lands which comprised the first Kiev and Bratslav province and remain in the possession of Poland until its fall.

Annexed territory was present Chernigov and Poltava provinces. And now under the MA in the official spheres they understand sometimes only these two provinces.

Based on the general map of Ukraine G. Boplana in the XVIII century. German cartographer Johann Baptist Homann, (1664-1724) published in 1716 map "Ukrania quae et Terra Cosaccorum" (Ukraine, the Cossack land and the neighboring provinces of Wallachia, Moldavia, Little Tartary).

Note the map of Ukraine in 1658, Figure 2
Or foundation-Typus generalis Ukrainae-1649 - Figure 3