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NATA NOVA 20.04.2010 19:12

Genghis Khan (okazyvaesya. ..)
 
Lola Pirhal of Genghis Khan:
Do not oppress the weak cub - he may be the son of a tiger "- Mongolian proverb

My father was poisoned and died, the family was robbed, the boy became a slave for a few years chained in the stocks ... the right conditions for self-development and self-reflection. Many would say: what I can, I was a child broken lives. He did not say. The ferment was different.

Genghis Khan - the leader of the brightest of the Middle Ages, is a leader with a distinct sense of empire - simply tremendous vision! And of those who are called according to his deserts are not tyrants, but just ruler. Lord of the wise and stern, just, sovereign, who created not only "Asian Rim" on the spot a crooked steppe grasslands, but also himself - Lord of the Universe - from doomed to almost certain death, her son, poisoned by the Tatars petty chieftain.

Perhaps another such personality Mongol Empire did not know. Genghis Khan called the greatest military genius and leader in history, in comparison with which Alexander of Macedon and Caesar seem insignificant. " Moreover, in recent years in the West, it is recognized as the most outstanding personality of this millennium, the man № 1 the last ten centuries! Meanwhile, in Russia, in the eyes of many, he still appears cruel barbarian ...

But we were brought up on the books of Basil Jan. More recently, helping a child in history, I suddenly with a big surprise for myself to discover that in fact everything, as always otherwise than in reality. simple fact: the Russian lands occupied by the Mongols long enough, not destroyed and not destroyed by any orthodox church. In the same Ukraine, which at that time was ruled by Poland, the exact opposite, no one has survived.

Historians of the West, observing and evaluating the part, came to the conclusion that Genghis Khan and his followers pursued the goal - set for Humanity era ideal of world order and prosperity, when the cease mutual war and create conditions for peace and prosperity of mankind in the field of spiritual and material culture.

How wrote Marco Polo, Mongol Empire was our country prosperous and rich, with a developed industry - various beautifully equipped workshops, mines, provides countries with ore and coal, with abundant gardens and fields, along all the roads were excellent inns. Special Service messengers delivers mail at a rate of four hundred miles a day. When Kublai began to produce paper money and other securities: was the beginning of the modern system of credit - based on the economies of all highly developed modern states. It was Marco Polo, except for the secrets of silk production and pasta, brought to Venice, the idea of issuing securities, promissory notes, and from here began their triumphant march through Europe and the world.

It is believed that the Mongols have led many nations of Eurasia foundations of statehood, democracy, pluralism, tolerance and freedom of religion, zakonosluzhenie and law-abiding, the rule of the constitution, the theory of military art, a progressive tax system, an intercontinental postage. Genghis Khan created a polity, which self-regulate and self-development, without requiring rigid control and repressive measures in their maintenance, ie so, to what we are today, in the troubled times of instability and loss of ideals, the collapse and loss of control, strive.
Lola Pirhal (Notification of leaders)

________________
I remember the interpretation fact that in times Chinziz Khan can safely ride with a silver dish on his head throughout the Empire .. (the order was)

NATA NOVA 21.04.2010 17:09

Вложений: 1
Genghis Khan:.

NATA NOVA 24.04.2010 14:52

Long thought ...
 
and I want to ask: Why is this period is called the "yoke"?
Because the emperor was a foreigner?

Сергей Дородный 11.06.2010 18:39

Цитата:

Сообщение от NATA NOVA (Сообщение 1046402)
 simple fact: the Russian lands occupied by the Mongols long enough, not destroyed and not destroyed by any orthodox church.

Do not simply destroyed. Under fear smernoy penalty, the name of Genghis Khan (by that time already ...) was banned harass the Russian Orthodox. Department of Sarai was where khans "big butt" requested. The son of Batu was Orthodox (and about Batu rumors, but not proven). And when the church wanted, then assembled the militia, and arranged for the Kulikov battle.
 For other countries, all those who stuck out above the skirting board, allowed to flow, and established their dynasty. And no no privileges.
 So it's not in education, as in "being determines consciousness."

It's like history with Stalin and Roosevelt.
"Give us, Daddy, 400,000 military trucks Studebaker! - Pray!"
"Come and see us, my friend, in a Tehran apartment! - Yes really, Che there!"
"Aircraft, stew, all come on! - Nate!"

Kept Stalin, Roosevelt soundly. (Thought Suvorov).
 By analogy - but did not have a Russian Orthodox Church has a major impact on the Mongol khans?

About Rights Millennium Arabic medieval historian Rashid al-Din wrote:
"When Taydzhiyuty, Urrutia and Mankguty ... obedient to him, he commanded the majority of them killed, and others give Dzhidanayonu into slavery ... and though they were his relatives, but have become slaves at his command ..."
A normal person millennium.

Wladzislaw 11.06.2010 23:19

Цитата:

Сообщение от NATA NOVA (Сообщение 1053032)
, and I want to ask: Why is this period called the "yoke"?
Because the emperor was a foreigner?

Foreigners - a second <!--~ a ~-->. From 1761 until 1917 the Russian throne does небыло anyone except the Germans, nor emperors, nor the empresses. And no yoke :) That's what propaganda does ... :D

MrVitt 14.06.2010 18:35

But with Germany, Russia has generally a special relationship, love as anyone :)
The last to take at least tying a campaign ribbon for German cars ...
Something from the field sadomasochistic ...:)

Мимопроходил 18.06.2010 19:08

Цитата:

Сообщение от NATA NOVA (Сообщение 1047902)
Genghis Khan:

I have, it seems, wrote about it - a friend and historian, told me that, based on the descriptions, look at the reality Genghis Khan. Before us, he got very different, since all the surviving portraits of him - the work of Chinese artists :)
And I've heard that the direct descendants, Chingizids, almost millions of people on the planet are, because in addition to his wife at the Genghis Khan had 500 concubines! And in his five "official" children - also in hundreds. So it turns out, the genes of Genghis Khan can be in any one of us :) "Good luck!

aleoss 18.06.2010 21:14

tyrant and executioner .........

NATA NOVA 18.06.2010 22:48

Цитата:

Сообщение от aleoss (Сообщение 1154962)
tyrant and executioner .........

aleoss, and it is possible with examples?

Мимопроходил 24.06.2010 16:59

Цитата:

Сообщение от NATA NOVA (Сообщение 1053032)
and I want to ask: Why is this period is called the "yoke"?
Because the emperor was a foreigner?

NATA, you are confused, the yoke shall be a period somewhere in the middle of 13 century. The devastating invasion into Russia began after the death of Genghis Khan. Burned and destroyed many, it is hard to argue. The list though here can see. In addition, Khan's troops with great pleasure involved in the princely feuds, and those willing to bear. You can somehow relate to the role of the yoke for Russia, as a tempering, or how to curse, but it was a very hard experience ... All the best!

Сима 24.06.2010 17:23

Цитата:

Сообщение от NATA NOVA (Сообщение 1046402)
But we were brought up on the books of Basil John.

NATA NOVA, and then many were brought up on books, LN Gumilev. If everything is connected, then all of Russia was just lucky. But you think about why our fate in the modern and contemporary times - overtaking modernization. Imagine a tribute to - "for a protein with smoke" on the "sword with smoke", etc. That's the number of "white" and "swords" in the year from each locality. Ie economics does not work on their people, to its development. And technology is evolving, not upgraded, because working on the nomads - another civilization. And if the development goes (and it is), then with great effort, and it is incumbent upon all segments of the population. Princes as politicians also had to spin.
     Look now objectively on Greece, Albania, Bulgaria, the Ottoman Balkans at all. And Romania! That's how the results look yoke. They just took less time than we have.

Konstantin 25.06.2010 11:09

Question (historical) "yoke" is very big and interesting. I read a lot on this subject (the content of literature is not a lot and very topical question of authenticity), and yet I have the impression that there is no oppression there was, it was a single state (in understanding), which was good for everyone. Why else would so actively our princes, instead of fighting the invaders actively involved in feuds tataromongolov as they are in our (the big question is whether Mongols).
  For example little known fact: Alexander Nevsky was twinned Sartak, son of Batu Batu, respectively, and was named for the father of Nevsky. Soviet history of this fact silent. In general, unfortunately, our history is still heavily politicized, hence the difficulty in the study.

Сима 25.06.2010 11:39

Konstantin, vice versa. In our history, and it was not enough as the policy content. Just this side very well represented at the Gumilev. Ie history not as "productive forces" and "productive relations" and not as a "great historic mission." And like real life, as a response to the challenges - not only economic but also political. These examples you just about politics - when pripret, even fraternize with the devil, and sit at the negotiating table. In my opinion, it was a "soft" colonialism. In the sense that the cost, of course, pumped out, the damage inflicted demographic, but politically left as a kind of vassalage.

Konstantin 25.06.2010 12:41

Вложений: 1
Now I do not claim to truth, but ...
Think about if everything was possible and necessary.
Цитата:

The article by Sergei Baymuhametova "And whether the yoke?" Is an example:
 
"The historian Gumilev without thinking leads a list of Russian surnames Tartar origin .... Aksakov Alyabjev, Apraksin, Arakcheyev, Arseniev, Akhmatov, Babichev, Balashov, Baranov, Basmanov, Baturin, Beketov, Berdyaev, Bibikov, Bilbasov, Bichurin, Boborykin, Bulgakov, Bunin, Burtsev Buturlin Bukharin, Veliaminov, Gogol, Godunov, Gorchakov, Gorshkov, Derzhavin Yepanchin Eromolaev, Izmailov, Cantemir, Karamazov, Karamzin, Kireyevsky, Korsakov, Kochubey, Kropotkin, Kurakin, Kurbatov, Kutuzov, Miliukov Michurin, Rachmaninov, Saltykov, Stroganov, Suvorov, Tagantsev, Talyzin, Taneyev, Tatishchev, Timashev, Timiryazev and Tretyakov, Turgenev, Turchaninov, Tiutchev, Uvarov, Urusov, Ushakov, hamsters, Chaadayev Shakhovskoi, Sheremetev, Shishkov, Yusupov ... It is clear that Gumilev calls names known that on hearing. Generally, dictionary of Russian names of Turkic origin, compiled by the philologist and historian Nikolai Alexandrovich Baskakov - is a big volume. Anyone who reviews it from cover to cover, inevitably thoughtful. From his constant confrontation oppressor and oppressed, the conquerors and conquered, in a word, from the yoke - this does not happen ... »
Sigismund Herberstein, who visited twice in Muscovy in the early 16 th century, resulting in an engraving look Vasily III.

Allena 25.06.2010 13:27

Цитата:

Сообщение от Konstantin (Сообщение 1161592)
Why else would so actively our princes, instead of fighting the invaders actively involved in feuds tataromongolov as they are in our (the big question is whether the Mongols).
For example little known fact: Alexander Nevsky was twinned Sartak, son of Batu Batu, respectively, and was named for the father of Nevsky.

I think it was the only way to survive. For hundreds of years was stalled any development, for waking up in the morning, every man did not know whether he will survive till the evening. What kind of development is possible in such an atmosphere of permanent fear of the animal - not just a fear of some possible problems, and specific fear for their lives?

In addition, the horde went not only material resources but also a lot of people (strong, young) got into slavery, so the fight was not the objective possibilities. Cooperation with the Horde was initially the only way to save lives, but much later - with the weakening of the Horde in the feud - way to achieve some personal goals.

And bro, and married - and what could I do? By the way, one must bear in mind that in the Middle Ages the psychology of people very different from our :) "Assimilation was pretty fast, and even names that are now considered native Russian actually have eastern roots.

There are examples in history when Russian princes refused to bow to idols, - the result of one: Take, for example, the story of Prince Mikhail of Chernigov and his nobleman Theodore. And because it is at this time, with the advent of St. Sergius Radonezhsky appear in Russia coenobitic monasteries, which approved the provisions of quietism - "smart doing", ie hotspots, so to speak, moral survival and strengthening largely demoralized people, which did not exist before.

Added after 3 minutes
Цитата:

Сообщение от Konstantin (Сообщение 1161642)
From the permanent confrontation oppressed and the oppressed, the conquerors and the conquered, in a word, from the yoke - this does not happen ...

This is a controversial assertion, which, in my opinion, does not consider single features discussion period - or time (centuries!), Nor the objective state of Russia and the Horde, nor the psychology of medieval man.


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