Форум по искусству и инвестициям в искусство

Форум по искусству и инвестициям в искусство (https://forum.artinvestment.ru/index.php)
-   Exhibitions and events (https://forum.artinvestment.ru/forumdisplay.php?f=86)
-   -   Artist put Mavromatti lives to vote in the shares of his /Alien (https://forum.artinvestment.ru/showthread.php?t=97102)

Тютчев 17.11.2010 03:10

Цитата:

Сообщение от Vladimir (Сообщение 1388501)
Here nudzhno clarify the issue. Who do you mean? Those who had been brought to suicide? Or representatives of "degenerate art", harried by the authorities? Or those who were sent into exile? Which format of the event we have in mind?

I thought very clearly formulated his question. Apparently not. Well, I'll try again: What is the name of the radical artist who, having written the new rules "(I quote your post), went so far as to claim those rights that the deliberately sacrificed his life for them (rules, ideas, beliefs)? Suicide is not suitable, because it is difficult to understand what the real causes (psychiatric diagnosis, kriminalnalnaya background or any other) of the act. "Hunted by the authorities" - is also rather vague. "Exile" - does not fit. You've given themselves definition:
Цитата:

Сообщение от Vladimir (Сообщение 1386971)
A pathetic obtained. Perhaps someone who is ready to write new blood regulations. And not on the keyboard.

In other words, one of the artists deliberately was martyred or suffering (here the analogy with the Christian martyrs) for the sake of their ideas, beliefs ? The key word here intentionally! Because Mavromati creates such a situation. Ie He allegedly knowingly suffer for the sake of clarifying the truth, and this manifests his radicalism. You do it like this to say when given the definition of the concept of "radical artist? Yes, and Mavromati playing on these senses?
Posted 1 hour 5 minutes
Цитата:

Сообщение от Vladimir (Сообщение 1388501)
Because in the broad sense, any good artist, no flyweight, the man ahead of their time paying with their lives for their ideas. Among the brightest people in general are not many long-lived.

Your pretty pathetic to me (I speak sincerely). But you know, after all, artists are people who are not very suitable for it is your ardent determination. Especially when it is necessary to move from words to defend its right. No, no, I do not blame them for it. I just want to say that art is something different than you have formulated. He is not on the barricades! It is born in a completely different environment. The artist may be inspired by, for example, social movements, all sorts of ideas and their diet, but what would they actively (an adult) to participate or to defend them, voluntarily condemning himself to misery ?!... And when, may I ask, create, or at least work? In her free from all this time? Typically, this is not really obtained. The artist is a man like all! And he often shared the fate of the nation, part of which is. He is just like everyone else, burdened by all those hardships, which are burdened with other people. He is just like everyone else, suffer, if necessary. And die like everyone else. It differs only in that it is capable of performing. And the present work requires concentration. Painter still is engaged in reflection, solving creative problems, understanding what is happening around and if you want, as a result of earning a living with his art (how many turns). But everything else - is postmodernistkaya puddle, in which we all have to flounder at the whim of any kind of political consultants and marketers (the artist Marc term relationship has not).
We must try to understand what is behind all this glitter. Behind all this bluff. And then ask yourself: Do I need to spend time on something that would collect the puzzle from the pieces that you cut someone, or better try to get myself into things?

Vladimir 17.11.2010 11:09

Цитата:

Сообщение от Tiutchev (Сообщение 1390251)
In other words, the artists who consciously accepted a martyr's death or suffering (here the analogy with the Christian martyrs) for the sake of their ideas, beliefs?

Understood. Condition, then is: if you do not stop drawing so, we have you executed. He never stops. And his execution. Something medieval. With the fire inquisition.

In such a pure example, I have not. After the war, it is hardly possible. And the examples of harassment, bullying and threats - a lot. Lentulov, Drevin, Malevich, many of the sixties, the German Expressionists, Baranov, Rossini, etc.

Peter 17.11.2010 13:31

There sits Mavromatti electrocuted and entertains his tscheslavie.Nazavtra Such write about him, he may even go down in history with this pathetic tryukom.Golosovanie is in an environment where the answer predskazuem.A if not predictable? A Russian roulette? "After all, the world
and death of red.

Konstantin 17.11.2010 14:05

Цитата:

Сообщение от Peter (Сообщение 1390651)
If it is not predictable? A Russian roulette?" After all, peace and death of red.

Well, you give ...
Poll showed that proves there are people who are willing to vote for that person died. And why do they want him dead? Because he's a maniac pedophile, rapist, murderer? None. For what he has something wrong paints.
Or even doing nails nailed himself. So what? Well, let them. Not only that there are idiots to himself cut or puncture. So in fact no, there are people who vote for it - death.
This is what we are talking about normal people? He was a provocateur? Yes.
But is important to the story in it? And the fact that among us there are people who are willing to kill, even through the ballot. I have not seen statistics - who and how many voted. Can someone tell me.

fabosch 17.11.2010 14:24

Vladimir, Tiutchev, it seems to me that the term "radical artist," as used in recent times, yet could not resist. Or maybe not resist, and sink into oblivion together with other similar terms. This we know is not given: the life of language - is a different story, is not subject to human desires.
However, if you try to analyze the texts, which use this term, one of them is deducted, it seems to me, not really what makes sense as a Vladimir. In these texts, rather it is a radical artistic positions of the artist, that is, about how his strategy update the concept of artistry. That is a radical here should understand the desire to change the understanding of art and engage in its sphere of something that in the conventional understanding of art is not likely. In this sense, I think "radical art" (if this term is generally regarded as correct) is descended from Duchamp or even of the first modernists (wild, Cubists, etc.). Thus, the current content of the term all the time. The present intention is for this phenomenon - the involvement in the arts of various socio-political action. In this sense, is absolutely not distinguish whether the driving nails just "hammering a nail," or "hammering the nail as an act of radical art." In any case, it seems to me that the personal qualities of the subject of such activities (the radical artist) are by no means the deciding factor. That is, whether he is ready to defend his position to go to any extreme steps, until the risk of losing life or health. Not everything that could be considered a radical art, fraught with such risks. And therefore it is not the hallmark of radical art

Tiutchev, on the radical art is a curious material Osmolovsky if you are really interested in
http://hghltd.yandex.net/yandbtm?fmo...14 & keyno = 0

With regard to Mavromatti, I would not try to judge how it all really (in the sense of threat to life). In any case, comment on it without such knowledge - not very well.

In any case, agree with Konstantin, that all this says more about us than about the artist. While agree that if he managed to show us the way we have - it already says something about him as an artist, whatever his motives subektivnye

Posav 17.11.2010 14:40

In my opinion, on this type of activity to say radical actionist, but not a radical artist.

SergeiSK 17.11.2010 14:54

Цитата:

Сообщение от Konstantin (Сообщение 1390681)
I have not seen the statistics - who and how many voted. Can someone tell me.

In the end, against the execution of 3,015 people voted for - 1591. The proceeds from the vote last money - about 800 euros - Mavromatti promised to spend on the organization in Sofia, a shelter for cats.
And the whole article, a brief summary of the rally, as submitted by Alexei Kadanera completely:
Internet pardoned Russian artist
In Internet calling performance ended the Russian artist Oleg Mavromatti titled "His /Alien." Electric chair on which sat an artist waiting for the outcome of voting, actuate not have: most of the users were opposed to punishment. In Russia Mavromatti, now living in Bulgaria, accused of inciting sectarian strife, and his performance art to show how the Internet can "shorten the path from the accuser to the accused."
In 2000 Oleg Mavromatti starred in the movie "oil spot" in one of the scenes which the artist himself crucified on a cross. This performance was called "Do not believe your eyes," and, according to Mavromatti not aimed to offend anyone's religious feelings. Moreover, the artist specifically crucified himself face to the cross, to avoid accusations of sinful act. Nevertheless, this action drew the attention of law enforcement agencies (in the words of Mavromatti, not without the help of the Union of Orthodox gonfalon "), and he had initiated a criminal case under article 282 of the Criminal Code.
This article ("inciting hatred or enmity") is notorious among the radical artists actionists in Russia. That's it in July 2010 were sentenced organizers of the exhibition "Forbidden Art" Andrei Erofeev and Yuri Samodurov, under it also came stock with an ax minced cardboard copy of the icons Avdei Ter-Oganyan "Young atheist, and if in the Criminal Code is the worst for artists article , then the number 282. Its main drawback, which is trying to resolve, having achieved the amendment of the Criminal Code, believe that in this paper can be held criminally liable for art events.
Oleg Mavromatti was forced to leave Russia after in connection with criminal charges in his home was searched, and the threat to get behind bars has become a little closer to reality. Ten years the artist lived between Bulgaria and the United States, and that in 2010 the term of his Russian passport had expired, were overdue and Bulgarian documents. Mavromatti offered to come to Russia for a new passport, but the artist chose to stay in Bulgaria and has asked local authorities to grant him refugee status. As he wrote in his LiveJournal to Russia, he was invited not only so, but for an immediate landing. "
In this difficult moment Mavromatti and came up with the idea of a performance by "The Insider /The Stranger". Especially for him was made replica electric chair, which was summed up current. Terms of the shares were fairly simple: for seven days on the Internet was open vote in which everyone, once registered, can vote for or against in order to let the current. Vote in favor of punishment in this case it was necessary to pay a symbolic sum of 50 cents.
Every voter had to somehow motivate the choice. Choose penalty justified reason differently: "Die! Thank <!--~ 1" -> "," just for fun, "" Die Another Day, because you're ugly, "" coin since fallen, "and even" What are you an artist? "You do evil under the guise of high rank. There is no such people for forgiveness." Those who were against it, wrote this: "No money, and would be killed," "Do not do that", "err you, maybe ... not so with life ... God forbid 'fools' will be more" , "The persecution of the artist on the obvious slander of religious fanatics - a shame for a country that considers it possible to consider itself civilized." Fortunately, they had more.
Reaction to what he did Oleg Mavromatti was particularly violent in the medium of his colleagues. The most powerful surge of emotions aroused, perhaps, a report chief editor of "Art" portal Openspace art krtitka Tar Catherine, who stayed away from the artist. In his article "Letter from Sofia: fist through the door" Tar, observing impeccable style, cold, pulverized Mavromatti as an artist and sometimes even as a person, not neglecting some not the most important household items. At its text does not answer just two last person in contemporary art and himself Mavromatti.
The first article, "Interesting interests Katie Tar" was made by artist Anatoly Osmolovskii, according to which the tar adheres to the so-called "left of critical theory." He was restrained and reasoned accused her of violating the basic principles of the left journalism, sadism and misanthropy, but thanked him for what she has put the diagnosis of Russian criticism. " Avdyei Ter-Oganyan was far less restrained.
In a rather cleverly written text, he called the Tar as women usually do not call, with one limited to not become an epithet. In essence, he said that Tar is confident: "The purpose of art and life are governed solely by the status intellectuals," and it's actually not true, and that she refused to support Mavromatti followed by the majority, to whom he ranked Marat Gelman, and Joseph Backstein among others. Mavromatti himself in his LJ only points out all the inconsistencies Tar preparation of interviews and in comments to the record convinces readers that she "can no malice." They did not believe him.
In the performance Mavromatti as rightly noted Osmolovskii, tragedy mixed with comedy in causing proportions ", and argue here, certainly have something. However, leaving aside the cultural nuances of the "Left critical theory" can not close our eyes to the undoubted artistic value of the shares Mavromatti. Here the artist, in fact, on one scale put their lives on the other - a reputation, because, again by Osmolovskii, if the stock ended pardon, it automatically turns into a farce. And in this case a better way and not otherwise.
In the end, against the execution of 3,015 people voted for - 1591. The proceeds from the vote last money - about 800 euros - Mavromatti promised to spend on the organization in Sofia, a shelter for cats. performance "his /Alien Mavromatti this declared complete, but on the project site will continue to place a video bridge with him, and will work chat. All are invited.
Alex Kadaner

Кирилл Сызранский 17.11.2010 15:10

Цитата:

Сообщение от Peter (Сообщение 1390651)
A Russian roulette?" After all, peace and death of red.

That's right, let the shot, it's called solidarity with his brother in the shop.
Or at serpentarium?
Цитата:

Conformity breeds aggression. After all, he teaches "do not stick out, be in the general range. Well this is the same mimicry, only social - when any animal like a chameleon blends with the environment, so this here is his defense mechanism. But sometimes the opposite, conformism is born from the desire of the individual to take revenge for what he is not the same as the surrounding. And from this contrast implies an imitation of surrounding yourself something different. A good example - the fashion. New fashion as an element of mass culture is born out of opposition to a previous, old fashion.
here.

Peter 17.11.2010 15:18

Цитата:

Сообщение от Konstantin (Сообщение 1390681)
Well, you give ...
Poll showed that proves there are people who are willing to vote for that person died.

you see skrolko people to vote for death? "It's quite a lot, even for normal obschestva.Dumayu that this whole performance-shot vpustuyu.On nothing no one showed, except for PR" artist. "Those who voted for the death of so answered provakatsiyu.Vse understood that "Shooter" ponaroshku.Vot if everyone was given a pistol, then there would be one of the five thousand, but Mavromatti would suffice and ego.I it would have real statistics.

fabosch 17.11.2010 15:29

Цитата:

Сообщение от Peter (Сообщение 1390821)
You see skrolko people to vote for death? "It's quite a lot, even for normal obschestva.Dumayu that this whole performance-shot vpustuyu.On nothing no one showed, except for PR" artist. "Those who voted for Death thus answered provakatsiyu.Vse understood that "shooters" ponaroshku.Vot if everyone was given a gun, then there would be one of the five thousand, but Mavromatti would suffice and ego.I it would have real statistics.

Can I call this act of artistic or not, but that in any case, the test for intolerance to "stranger" (as correctly noted Konstantin). This mirror, which put it to our face. Yes, we know that is not reality but a reflection, but nevertheless, most people refer to a "reflection of reality" is completely responsible.
With regard to real guns, it's all nothing says, because among the 5,000 there is always some crazy, ready to shoot, especially if it is for nothing. This is just sick


Часовой пояс GMT +3, время: 00:11.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.3
Copyright ©2000 - 2025, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd. Перевод: zCarot