Форум по искусству и инвестициям в искусство

Форум по искусству и инвестициям в искусство (https://forum.artinvestment.ru/index.php)
-   Costs, valuation, attribution (https://forum.artinvestment.ru/forumdisplay.php?f=6)
-   -   Mark Rothko (https://forum.artinvestment.ru/showthread.php?t=196)

uriart 15.10.2012 11:15

Цитата:

Сообщение от Cyril Syzran (Сообщение 2297321)
He himself so called himself, by the way, still in Russian "I - a man".
<! - ~ 7 ~ ->

I am glad that I was not mistaken appreciated his skill.

vg_edger 15.10.2012 11:38

Rothko
 
Rothko prices - a consequence of psychological techniques (manipulation), based on the use of human cognitive biases, especially the herd instinct:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cognitive_bias

By its nature, formed by thousands of years, people - gregarious mammals, it tends to take the view, and follow the behavior of the majority to feel safe and to avoid conflicts. These people - about 98%, only 2%of people are more or less able to think for themselves (critically). With these numbers and the characteristics of the human psyche are familiar large speculators financial market that simple receptions can form a long and strong upward or downward trend in any of its financial assets. For example, an influential investment fund (puppeteer), bought a large stake in the company X, includes the work of journalists under the control of the media, analysts, anchors, etc., creates the necessary background information and on this background methodically continues to buy shares of X, which leads to a stable raise their prices. After some time, part puppeteer is not required - the existing trend picks up the crowd and all the other analysts (art), which firmly believe that the stock X is very promising, will grow for a long time and that these findings - the result of their own research and conclusions. Rising prices lead to more demand for action on the part of many investors and funds that ultimately raises the prices literally through the roof, sometimes in the thousands. The entire process can take years. At the peak demand Fund, organized fraud, merges its shares (picture) thirsty crowd and lose interest in the subject.

Exactly the same technology used in creating demand for products of Malevich, Rothko, Warhol and other debris, the real artistic value of which is approximately at the same level as the migrant workers painted wall of a public toilet. At the peak of the stock bubble of high-tech companies (the so-called dot-com) in 2000 heard a few voices able to think critically of people who said that the current prices - this is nonsense and consequence of elementary manipulations, but they immediately threw tomatoes famous high-paid analysts with Harvard and Oxford diplomas . Today, just as in the ability to think critically upon by large crowds of people, "art", which, because of the primitive own thinking religiously convinced that they saw something special in a frank and daub that these works is the art and the cost certainly exceed cost of a roll of toilet paper. Themselves, "contemporary artists", by the way, are well aware that they vparivayut candid stuff.

But we must pay tribute to the organizers of these scams, scam does require a certain talent and relatively severe initial investment. Now inflate new bubbles in the sector of "art." For example, the image:

http://www.christies.com/lotfinder/s...&viewType=list

Кирилл Сызранский 15.10.2012 11:57

Цитата:

Сообщение от vg_edger; 2297731"
Exactly the same technology used in creating demand for the product Malevich , Rothko , Warhol and other debris , the real artistic value of which is approximately at the same level as the migrant workers painted wall of a public toilet .

You iskustvoved or "waste" call that does not like you personally , and what is this " demand for works by Malevich "? What might be a demand for things that are not on sale?
 
Цитата:

Сообщение от vg_edger; 2297731"
but they immediately threw tomatoes famous high-paid analysts with Harvard and Oxford diplomas.

And you can see the names of the " highly distinguished analysts from Harvard and Oxford diplomas " ?
Цитата:

Сообщение от vg_edger; 2297731"
But we must pay tribute to the organizers of these scams , scam does require a certain talent and relatively severe initial investment.

What were the " initial investment " in a scam with Rothko ? How long it took to all Roco paintings on the market in the last decade, the price went from a million dollars?

Konstantin 15.10.2012 12:47

Цитата:

Сообщение от vg_edger; 2297731"
in the formation of demand for the product Malevich , Rothko , Warhol and other debris

Since the first time you write to us , and with such strong statements, to ask you to say a few words about myself.
For what?
To forum members (most of whom art business professionals who do not need to tell who the Malevich and why it costs so ) to understand how to react to your words.

vg_edger 15.10.2012 14:18

Цитата:

Сообщение от Konstantin (Сообщение 2297771)
... have to ask you to say a few words about myself.

I am a specialist of the stock market , working with financial assets for about 15 years . At the same time interested in art , about 10 years working with leading auction houses with the heads of some of them have long known personally. Love the Russian portraiture ages 18-19 as the opposite of the above-named " art."

Very interested in the topic of cognitive Finance and as a result , the theme of origin and extinction trends, bubbles, and management techniques . This theme made ​​me pay attention to the degenerate art , as it is in this sector bubbles and psychological manipulation was so widespread , that envy even a beat every stock market.

I'm sorry if I hurt the feelings of someone else . Maybe I'm too blunt and direct state his attitude to the subject . I do not claim absolute truth , this is just my personal opinion.

Кирилл Сызранский 15.10.2012 14:36

Цитата:

Сообщение от vg_edger; 2297841"
This theme made ​​me pay attention to the degenerate art

Hitler with Goebbels called " degenerate art " I know , I wonder what the authors you to their list of degenerates placed ?

Although , apparently, I have another question asking for nothing and, judging by the silence of the stock market expert and lover of Russian portrait painting on my specific questions here, remains a classic to remember : [COLOR=Navy"]... let me answer. No answer[/COLOR] ( c). :)

artcol 15.10.2012 14:38

Цитата:

Сообщение от vg_edger (Сообщение 2297841)
I like the Russian portraiture ages 18-19 as the opposite of the above-named "art".

In general I agree, but Malevich You should not squeezed into this happy.

Konstantin 15.10.2012 14:43

Цитата:

Сообщение от vg_edger; 2297841"
At the same time interested in art, about 10 years old

When Malevich call garbage , do it on the basis of his 10 years of experience and work with the leading auction houses? Or from visiting the Tretyakov Gallery where the paintings of Malevich
Or museum professionals also do not understand good art, but only in degenerative ?

Added after 1 minute
Цитата:

Сообщение от artcol; 2297861"
nothing in this series squeezed .

No this is well characterized for the particular discussion.

[color="#666686 " ]Added after 3 minutes[/color]
Цитата:

Сообщение от artcol; 2297861"
are in general agreement

And with what? With that that Rothko - bubble? But then the question of "specialists of the financial markets " and Malevich ? And explain to us the difference ...

vg_edger 15.10.2012 14:53

Цитата:

Сообщение от artcol (Сообщение 2297861)
Malevich ... You should not squeezed into this happy .

Not sure what reason.
Did you read carefully this book?
http://www.raruss.ru/avant-garde/1280-suprematism.html

I read this and some other similar many times at intervals of a few days. I thought that maybe I do not understand. As a result, he concluded that it is simply a collection of words without meaning , of which anyone can understand anything. As of "Black Square " by the way . The desire to get people to find meaning where it is not - essential trick of the industry.

Konstantin 15.10.2012 15:40

Цитата:

Сообщение от vg_edger (Сообщение 2297841)
because it is in this sector bubbles and psychological manipulation was so widespread, that envy even a beat every stock market.

Can you give an example of psychological manipulation?


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