Форум по искусству и инвестициям в искусство

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rainyday 09.03.2010 02:32

Цитата:

Сообщение от Guriev, Igor (Сообщение 970352)
And someone opposes?

Is, for example, Matisse contrasted?

Matisse is not opposed,
and Clement Greenberg - contrasted
so in New York is no "illusion"
among the "serious artists"
at the time and was :rolleyes:

but no local artists Greenberg was not terrible,
New York is far and as artist-teachers
they are not so dependent on the mood of critics and dealers

Игорь Гурьев 09.03.2010 02:46

Цитата:

Сообщение от Greenberg
In fact, the avant-garde poet and avant-garde artist is trying to imitate God by creating something treatable justification solely in his own categories - just as nature finds a justification in itself, just as aesthetically justified landscape - the real but not his image, as something given, miraculous, independent of meanings, similarities or originals.
Must be dissolved in the form as fully to the work of the artist or writer can not be reduced, in whole or in part, to something that would not have been the very essence of art.

Once плосковато and boring, the second Comrade Greenberg wrote ...

What is the phrase "nature finds a justification in itself" - which immediately after the words of God.

rainyday 09.03.2010 03:06

Цитата:

Сообщение от Guriev, Igor (Сообщение 970392)
Once плосковато and boring, the second companion Greenberg wrote ...

this I do not agree with you,
just my opinion, Comrade Greenberg wrote
internally persuasive
believing in what he says

and most of his ideas, I fully agree with him
(although as a model of kitsch
I would not give Repin for example)

the problem was just in some of his extremism
he's so all there in New York intimidated
attacks on any even chance of something like
or occasionally three-dimensional image,
that the tyranny of his could not cause
response revolution :cool:

and alas, so they despised kitsch
back in new guises conceptualized
winning and renowned art fair
as more avant-garde :(

Se in contrast
neither Park nor any Dibenkorn Bischof with Greenberg did not fight
and were soon on his side
just their abstract included the
conventionally representational art as a certain part

but their realism is not quite the same realism
that Repin

Кирилл Сызранский 09.03.2010 03:16

Цитата:

Сообщение от Guriev, Igor (Сообщение 970392)
Once плосковато and boring, the second companion Greenberg wrote ...

For 39-year? :D

LCR 09.03.2010 03:18

Цитата:

Сообщение от rainyday (Сообщение 970302)
but I can not agree with your interpretation
Is Ocean Park Dibenkorna a complete rejection of abstraction?

Of course, you're right. But I talked about the work of these artists in the years 1940-60. Where, in my opinion, can and should speak about the rejection of abstraction. Returning to her Diberkorna (Series Ocean Park Paintings), and Bischoff goes beyond the reporting period. Nevertheless, I admit my guilt - I have not specified the time frame rassmatrizhvaemogo direction.

Игорь Гурьев 09.03.2010 03:20

Цитата:

Сообщение от Cyril Syzransky (Сообщение 970432)
For 39-year? :D

Sure.

Because by this time had long been over, and he just woke up.

Ortega y Gasset in any years better than writing.

And much.

Кирилл Сызранский 09.03.2010 03:27

Цитата:

Сообщение от Guriev, Igor (Сообщение 970452)
Ortega y Gasset in any years better than writing.

But whether he knew Repin? :D

Игорь Гурьев 09.03.2010 03:28

Цитата:

Сообщение от rainyday (Сообщение 971)
but their realism is not quite the same realism
that Repin

Do not quite understand.

Repin (in the best years) the same realism that, for instance, Millet, Chardin, Guardi, Velazquez and others

Do not see any differences.

You can say that C-F school "realism" of another type?

Кирилл Сызранский 09.03.2010 03:30

Цитата:

Сообщение от Guriev, Igor (Сообщение 970472)
Y Repin (in the best years)

This is what is-best?

Игорь Гурьев 09.03.2010 03:32

Цитата:

Сообщение от Cyril Syzransky (Сообщение 970462)
But whether he knew Repin? :D

I think yes.

He was generally very well educated man.

Кирилл Сызранский 09.03.2010 03:33

Цитата:

Сообщение от Guriev, Igor (Сообщение 970492)
He was generally very well educated man.

And you did Rebelión de las Masas read in Spanish?

Игорь Гурьев 09.03.2010 03:34

Цитата:

Сообщение от Cyril Syzransky (Сообщение 970482)
This is what is, "best years"?

Well, "Pirogov", sleeping in a chair from the Saratov Museum, and the early "Preparing for the exam."
But you never know ...

Repin many wonderful works.

And what do you do not like Ilya Efimovich?

I'm not saying what he was draftsman ...

Added after 37 seconds
Цитата:

Сообщение от Cyril Syzransky (Сообщение 970502)
And you do Rebelión de las Masas read in Spanish?

No, only in Russian.

I'm in Spanish I do not read.

Кирилл Сызранский 09.03.2010 03:41

Цитата:

Сообщение от Guriev, Igor (Сообщение 970512)
No, only in Russian.

In Soviet translation?

rainyday 09.03.2010 03:42

Цитата:

Сообщение от Guriev, Igor (Сообщение 970472)
Do not quite understand.

Repin (in the best years) the same realism that, for instance, Millet, Chardin, Guardi, Velazquez and others

Do not see any differences.

You can say that C-F school "realism" of another type?

Yes that's right - abstracted realism
that was not Repinsky realism
Repin, although I really respect and kitsch have nicknamed it did not,

for artists' posleabstraktsionistov "
so to speak

depicted object is only cause
for painting as an organization of color and form in the plane of the canvas
and how to write books:
story concocted for any resemblance to real people and events
artist is not responsible :rolleyes:

therefore such categories as
"and I got the color," rather than a crooked vase ":cool:
such an artist simply can not think

Added after 5 minutes
Цитата:

Сообщение от LCR (Сообщение 970442)
Of course, you're right. But I talked about the work of these artists in the years 1940-60. Where, in my opinion, can and should speak about the rejection of abstraction. Returning to her Diberkorna (Series Ocean Park Paintings), and Bischoff goes beyond the reporting period. Nevertheless, I admit my guilt - I have not specified the time frame rassmatrizhvaemogo directions.

thanks

the only thing that I
"rejection of abstraction" does not seem
return to the old realism
as some opportunistic step back
or floating with the party line

such as the pampered and that's enough --
need to do business again

on the contrary - I think it is a movement
perfectly reasonable and natural
is an honest study of borders in both directions
and finding its place among

Игорь Гурьев 09.03.2010 03:49

Цитата:

Сообщение от Cyril Syzransky (Сообщение 970532)
In Soviet translation?

Hmm. Translated Geleskula for the History of Aesthetics in monuments and documents. "

He had been reduced as necessary.

Wholly he published in Problems of Philosophy "in 1989, but I have not seen.

However, with Ortega, I was never going to read.


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